PODCAST QUESTIONS
How was your Christmas? What colour best represents how you’re feeling today? Can you tell me a bit about your background? Does your anxiety come from the passing of your father? Do you feel that people weren’t comfortable talking about anxiety & depression back then? Would you be able to give us some tips into how you have managed anxiety? What do you do to truly relax?
TRANSCRIPT
Frederique
Hi Adam! How are you? I can’t hear you. I think you’re on mute.
Adam
Maybe you can hear me now?
Frederique
Yes.
Adam
Great. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. How are things?
Frederique
Not too bad. Not too bad. I have to admit that the past few days, I had difficulties to sleep, but I guess it’s because… apparently it’s very common. A lot of people are suffering from insomnia during the pandemic. So…
Adam
It’s an extraordinary set of circumstances thou, isn’t it? So it’s going to be… It’s not the easiest of times, is it? You know, I think we have to forgive ourselves a little bit. Sometimes when we’re feeling a bit anxious, or feeling a little bit low, that we have to remember that we’re living in extraordinary times.
(Introduction music plays then stops)
Frederique
How do you feel?
Adam
Some days… um, it depends, really, if I’m not busy. If I’m not doing something, I tend to think about it more. But if, if I’m busy, like I am today, and this whole week, doesn’t really bother me in the slightest. The office is here in the house, we both work from home. It’s quiet. That’s it really.
Frederique
Yeah.
Adam
We just get on with what we’re going to do, really. I try not to watch the news too much. I’m gonna try and watch it once a day.
Frederique
Yeah, I agree with you. I don’t….
Adam
I don’t want you to stop.
Frederique
Yeah, go on.
Adam
No, it’s just too much. It’s overload.
Frederique
Yeah, it’s overload, yeah. This is really stressing and my, my anxiety is up the roof… this is how you say it?
Adam
Yeah.
Frederique
I, I, yeah, I have a lot of difficulties to sleep. But I try to, as you said, as yourself, keep myself busy. But then, you know, when you don’t sleep, you get tired. And then you… It’s like, it’s a lot to consider, but it’s okay, I mean… we could be in a very bad, you know, situation, you know, because there are people who are suffering. There are, there is war, there is famine, or whatever.
Adam
Exactly.
Frederique
And I’m not in that case. So…
Adam
Well, now, and you’ve got to consider there are some countries that their infrastructure isn’t there. So they can’t, they don’t have the opportunity to isolate, they don’t have the opportunity to have access to medical facilities like we do, you know? There are people in an awful lot worse situation at this moment than we are, particularly those in what we traditionally called Third World countries, in other developing countries, as we call them now.
Frederique
This is so true…
Adam
It’s a whole lot worse, and yet, where we, you know, we’ve got four walls. We’ve got reasonable stability, and.
Frederique
Food…
Adam
…safety, food, clean water.
Frederique
Clean water. Exactly, exactly.
Adam
So we got a lot to thank- be thankful for, really, more so than, than not, although, you know, people are slipping away around us, probably not to the same volumes as in other places. It’s hard, isn’t it?
Frederique
Yeah. Yeah. And I really feel for those who have children, for example, and who cannot leave their home when they are in danger, for example. There’s a lot of domestic abuse cases and, and I really do feel, you know, for all the people who are suffering, I have to admit, I really think about, you know, everyone, very often, I should say. I pray for them, and I do understand how tough it can be.
Adam
It is, it’s horrendous. Some, like you said, some households, you know, they have violence to deal with as well and, you know, most the times the short term solution to this is to get out the house and go somewhere else. But you can’t do that right now.
Frederique
Yes.
Adam
Everybody’s stuck indoors. And some people stuck indoors with their worst enemies.
Frederique
This is so true.
Adam
I guess we have to be thankful that we’re not in that situation ourselves. But-
Frederique
Oh, yeah.
Adam
You just don’t know, do you?
Frederique
Oh, yeah.
Adam
But how was your break? Christmas break? Holidays have been- you had a nice time?
Frederique
Um, yes, I cooked a lot. I love Christmas. This is my time of the year, I enjoy every single thing about you know, Christmas and New Year, so I cannot complain. My son was a bit strange about it because he said to me, ‘oh, it doesn’t feel really like Christmas’. But I tried to make it… Christmassy as… as Christmassy as possible.
Adam
Uh huh.
Frederique
So that… was that- I mean to me, I think I did a good job. But yeah, I really enjoyed my time. What about you?
Adam
Very quiet, very peaceful. Nothing major going on. Just relaxed. Ate the wrong kind of food, but nice food, um, caught a cold. A little bit of one, but I’m alright. And just relaxed really, at home. Didn’t go out, put the fire on, had a couple of drinks. Just a real quiet, sedate sort of Christmas, which is what we wanted really, you know?
Frederique
Yeah.
Adam
People we love, tones of visiting, and all that sort of stuff. It gets a bit tedious, doesn’t it?
Frederique
Exactly, exactly.
Adam
We don’t do all year round. What do you want to do on one day?
Frederique
So true.
Adam
I am a mystery cuts when it comes to Christmas.
Frederique
So, okay, let me know about a colour that represents the way you feel today. And tell me why you chose to use this colour?
Adam 7:27
Great question. It’s a really interesting question. I don’t know- when I saw that- it was like, seems like some sort of psychology test I think now, so I was googling to find out what was going on or, you know, as I do, as a researcher, a fellow researcher, but I guess… can we go shades of the colour? Or do we have to be specific? Fine on.
Frederique
Um, whatever you feel like?
Adam
I’m thinking sky blue.
Frederique
Okay.
Adam
And the reason why it’s sky blue is because it’s always kind of been my favourite colour from, from, from childhood, because it represents to me a vast expanse freedom and infinity, you know, that endless beauty… We’re sounding like a romantic now…. I’m not.
Frederique
Yeah, it sounds so good.
Adam
It’s, it’s such a background. It’s got a nice background. Um, but sky blue it just represents… It’s just a pure colour. And it’s just beautiful. So, you know, the happiest moments are when you’re stood outside, the sun’s in your face, and then you managed to open your eyes for a second. Just this vast blue clear expanse, no clouds. It just represents a very happy thing for me, I think. And that’s why I love that colour.
Frederique
Awww I love it, it’s such a good idea. Yeah, you just described it so well. I am very interested in your background. Okay, can you tell us a little bit more about about you, where you were born? How many siblings you have and what your family unit was like, in general?
Adam
Yeah, I mean, I’m from a little suburb in Birmingham, called Stechford. I no longer live there, we’ve moved up to Yorkshire now, but when I was growing up in a typically, I would say, it started out sort of quite middle class neighbourhood, you know? Both parents worked, I’ve got four brothers, sorry, three brothers. I’m one of four brothers. And it was quite a noisy childhood. Very musical. We had lots of music in the house all the time. We had a record player that was always on. Listened to all kinds of things, all sorts of music from everywhere. We had a piano, which my brother, my oldest brother, played, and my grandmother played a bit as well, although I never heard her play. But I was told she did. And… most of the time, she was just grumpy, to be quite honest. But yeah, it was a, it was a really, really happy childhood, no, nothing extraordinary. We weren’t vastly wealthy, we went camping on holiday, we had camping holidays, so we… It wasn’t.. you know, as expensive as having, you know, our mom, dad, and four brothers in a hotel, we all go, get our tent, go down to Wales with my cousins and stuff like that, and we’d have a big, you know, ‘let the kids run free and feral’ and it was…. it was lovely. And then, it all kind of changed when I was about, just trying to think now, I was about nine. And my dad became ill, to the point where he could no longer do his business and we, we suddenly went from, you know, being okay financially to being absolutely destitute within a couple of weeks, really bad. Of course, being the youngest of four, a lot of this was kept away from me, because I was, you know, I was only, I was the baby of the family as it were. So it was, it was, it was the thing then, was to keep each- keep the youngest sheltered from it all, don’t tell him anything. And then, really, watching my dad kind of get worse and worse, and worse, and worse, and worse, throughout my whole teenage really. And he passed away a couple of weeks before I was 21. So still quite young when, when he, when he, when he died. And luckily for me, I had my mum for much longer, but she only passed away a few years ago, but… So typically, as a child, quite happy- teenage was a bit traumatic, really, because it was kind of like, my parents are really trying hard to keep me going. But I was, you know, I was watching, you know, you know, going from hand to mouth, and watching my dad, a man who I really admired, really… you know? Sons generally do look up to their fathers quite, quite a lot, you know? It’s that expectation in society during that period, you know, the father led the way and the sons followed. I always wanted to be in my father’s business, which was photo- photography.
Frederique
Oh, wow.
Adam
He was a photojournalist and… So I wanted to follow in his footsteps or join the business when I was old enough. And it didn’t happen for me, which, you know, it’s a shame, but, but it’s just the way things are. But back then I was quite gutted that, you know, I was like, ‘I really wanted to be part of the business and go out working with dad and, and, you know, learning stuff from him’. And, and I never had that opportunity and it’s a lot. I think, compounded just the way off with hormones during teenage years that… it was quite a difficult period, because that part of your life, that sort of 12 to 18/19 years old, maybe a little longer, it’s a really difficult part of your life. Although I miss certain aspects of it, I certainly wouldn’t wish to revisit those years. Again, from a personal perspective, because you’re not quite mature enough to understand what’s going on in your own body, although you feel that you are mature enough. So this compounding view of your own self, and he spent a good 10 years, a good decade, of that period, kind of constantly questioning what’s going on, and then not understanding it, not knowing where to get the answers from, or having the emotional maturity to deal with some of the bigger problems and… not seeking help. I spoke about this a few weeks ago to a, to a family member and said, ‘Can you imagine that being a nine year old me would care?’ Many of it because no one was giving me any answers, and I was too scared to ask. Because I was frightened to what the answers would be. So this created quite a, quite a depresssion style, really…
Frederique
Stress…
Adam
And stress, yeah, that was stressful for a teenager. I’m not saying I’m, you know, by any means in the worst position, in the most worse position than anybody else. But for me at that time, it was, it was quite difficult, really. I struggled to come to terms with an awful lot of things.
Frederique
And do you think that was your… this is where your anxiety and depression comes from? Or do you feel that there was much- that was something that was in in- within you, from a very early age?
Adam
So its the nature nurture question really isn’t it, it’s whether something is either inherited, is mental health inherited? Or is it something that’s a victim of circumstance? And I think there are, there are character traits within families to have an introspective view about how you, you know, how you look upon yourself and upon the world. So you’re looking inward. You know, a lot of people that are academic to the same thing, you find a lot of people in academia are quite sort of inward looking, sort of trying to seek answers within themselves that sometimes they don’t have the answer to, and certainly, from my perspective, as a child, I was too afraid to ask. I had no idea what that fear was, or how it, how it came to. But I remember having loads of questions in my head asking, ‘hell, what’s going on with dad? Is he dying?’ It was one question I wanted to ask, but I, I certainly didn’t want to hear that the answer was yes…. and it was quite a tricky, quite a tricky, period, really. I think… because I’m inquisitive, that, you know, I like to know what’s going on with everybody else, and myself. I think that, that doesn’t always help but it does in certain sectors. But, but certainly, in relation to depression, and anxiety, it doesn’t help. Because you’re the kind of person who wants to ask a million questions, but because there’s so many, you don’t know where to begin. And that’s, that’s a really difficult starting point, really. So I don’t think it helps sometimes that, you know, these circumstances happen, and so on and so forth. But I think if you’re already the kind of person that picks up on these things, then, then you will always be susceptible to it, do you what I mean? It’s like the vibrations of this guy I knew. This guy I know, talks, talks about tuning forks and you know, vibrating in one hand, that’s you in a tuning fork, and then, the rest of the world and obviously, whatever that’s going on, whatever that’s going on, in this situation. So for example, even depression. Depression tuning force going on, and the closer you get to it, the more you attune to it and if you’re always around it… if you’re in a horrible situation, or less than, a less, less than satisfactory situation, like I was when I was a kid, and… you tend to gravitate towards it. My mother wasn’t a particularly positive person. It was quite comedic, her approach, her sort of, you know, attitude, occasionally… She was a wonderful woman, I will never say anything less than that. But she, in her.. by her own admittance, wasn’t a particularly optimistic character. So when you’re around someone who isn’t optimistic, and you love them, no?
Frederique
It’s hard…
Adam
It’s hard. It’s difficult.
Frederique
Yes.
Adam
And particularly me, I’ve always you know, I always try and find the positive in most things. But sometimes it’s like, trying to fight a losing battle. And you often, you can misfire and try to find the positive in a situation that isn’t positive at all. And then you get depressed because you can’t do anything about it. And that’s where I found myself really, at that particular point. But, yeah, my first sort of feelings on that were really around watching my dad getting ill, and not knowing what to say, what to do, or whether I could do anything. Because everyone’s like, ‘it’s not that bad, don’t worry about it. It’s fine, you know? Everything’s fine.’ It was far from it. It was it was completely the opposite, you know? It’s the point where I had teachers talking to me, taking me aside at school to see if I was okay or not. ‘Why are you asking these questions for what’s what’s going on? What do you know that I don’t? What’s my mom said to you?’ You know, it’s difficult.
Frederique
Do you… Do you… So you felt that people were not very comfortable talking about anxiety and depression? I mean, at the time, I guess, you would not even know that that was what it was.
Adam
No, it wasn’t, it wasn’t spoken about like it is now. There was no, you know, nowadays, there are things in place, there are mental health teams there are… there’s proper infrastructure, I mean… the science of mental health, there’s an awful long way to go. For the, you know, the psychology side and the physical side, the medical side, there’s an awful lot still to develop. But considering where we were 30 years ago, to where we are now, there’s a vast difference in terms of support. Young carers, for example, when you’re a kid, and you’re looking after someone with a disability… 30 years ago, you’d be very lucky to get any help at all. Nowadays, albeit, it’s not ideal, and there’s still loads and loads of road to go, there is help out there in, in the forms of charities, in the forms of NHS structure. It’s not great, but it’s getting there and it’s a lot further than we were 30 years ago. The same for mental health support for young teenagers as well. If I had that support, when I was a kid, I think I’d have fared better in my teens and my 20s, that’s for sure. Could’ve given me some tools, given me someone to talk to about it, instead of having this you know, being very insular and very closed by talking about these things, and I guess that’s why when I got to… when 21 hit, and I was grieving for my, for my dad, I just packed everything and left Birmingham and, and put it all… tried to put it all behind me, really.
Frederique
Do you…. Would you be able to give us some tips on how to deal with, um, especially with anxiety? Because I don’t know if that is the case for you but for me, I first experienced anxiety and then… the depression sinking. So I have triggers that brings really deep anxiety and sometimes panic attacks, and then I have this guilt, the guilt and the, you know, the spiral? Is it spiral? Yeah.
Adam
Yes, spiral, yeah.
Frederique
So I don’t know, if you would like to share with us some kind of tips that you used to help you manage your, your anxiety, you know, on a daily basis or whenever it appears, and whenever you have the triggers.
Adam
Yeah…. and these are things that I’ve only kind of started doing in the last couple of years, really, more than anything. More so, in the last 12 months, and doing the master’s degree, really helped with these things because they give you an awful lot of tools to work with, to help through these anxious moments, you know, the anxious moments, for example, we had with assignment deadlines and writing dissertations and will… ‘you know, will it pass? Will it get a merit? Will it get a distinction?’ You know, all those sort of stresses, and what I tend to do, and I’ve gone through CBT, cognitive behavioural therapy quite a bit, and one of the things I learnt was, was when when a moment comes, when anxiety happens, it’s not a thought. It’s a physical feeling. So when you get anxious, you’re not.. you don’t sit there and go, ‘I’m anxious’. Your stomach knots up, you get sweaty, you know, you’re twitching and you’re like, ‘what…’ the first thing is ‘what’s happening here? What’s going on?’ Your body goes, ‘whoa, whoa, I wasn’t expecting this, what’s brought this up’. So when, when I’ve got those moments, I acknowledge those feelings, the physical feelings and then, ‘okay, take a step back for just two seconds. What is making me feel like this?’
So for example, I get stressed out, and I’d be like, pacing up and down, up and I do avoidance tactics as well. So I go off and watch Star Wars all day on TV, instead of looking at my assignment, and then, these are anxiety, avoidance tactics and I go, ‘what, come on, what what are you doing?’ So what I did from there was that, again, rightly, ‘I’ve got this to do. This is my target. This is where I’m at the moment. And this is where I think I should be. Where I think I should be, what I think I need to be at that particular point, can I kind of waste a day watching TV or not?’ really sensibility. So by just picking at it, bit by bit, or pulling it apart and going, ‘you know what? I’ll do… I’ll set myself a target. I’ll do 1000 words a day. By hook or by crook, I’ll do 1000 words a day’.
I further developed that say, when the bigger assignments started happening or the ones that were sat next to each other, I’ll go, ‘I will do… for three days, four hours a day. No more, no less. Regardless of whether it’s finished or not finished, I will put myself upstairs for four hours’. And I did it, and I was quite amazed by the results, because what I found was, when as soon as I put some discipline into what I was doing, and some structure, the anxiety disappeared, because I saw instant result to my symptoms, to the question of ‘what am I going to do?’
So when, you know when these things, there’s those feelings of, you know, sickness, when you’re stressed, and you can’t sleep, you get the insomnia, you get- or you get the opposite, which I got quite a bit, which was like, ‘I just wanted to sleep’. It’s recognising those things…. identifying them. Even saying them out loud, helps, you know? ‘I’m feeling sick. Why am I feeling sick? Do I need to feel sick? No’. These are just… this is just physical manifestations of your subconscious mind and if it’s in your subconscious, it’s not really a problem. Because you don’t really think about it, it’s just when they’re physically manifest, it makes it difficult.
So when, for me, not to get depressed about doing an assignment or whether I want to achieve a good mark, I would give myself absolute structure to the point where it was like, ‘between one and two o’clock, I will have my lunch break and then I’ll return back to work at two o’clock, work till four, and as soon as four cups finished, the laptop goes off and I go downstairs’. So putting some structure into your anxiety, it helps.
And appreciating fear as well. Because fear is a huge factor in these things. Fear of getting the assignment wrong, fear of not achieving something can often… not help in achieving what we need to do. So recognising that you’re in, you know, you’re in a, you’re in your comfort zone and the only reason why you’re failing is because you’re coming out of your comfort zone.
Frederique
And I just wonder… so, you mentioned Star Wars, but what do you do to relax, to truly relax?
Adam
Uh, I never truly relax. But I love watching movies. I love watching, um, I don’t know, absolutely obliterated Netflix these last few months, watching various series and revisiting series that I enjoy, comedies and all sorts of things really. I started to read again, which is a good sign for me, because reading for pleasure is something I have no concentration on. But I actually managed to read almost half a book in these last few weeks, so I’m quite pleased with that. So we’re getting there, small steps and all that. My brains always on the go, constantly. If I’m sat, you know, the conversations I have in myself, in my head, just before I go to sleep about, ‘oh, what about we’re gonna do this tomorrow, let’s plan this out, I need to email such and such, I need to do that, maybe I could develop this. Oh, I’ve got an idea for a podcast’. And that’s how my brain works before I get to sleep. But I do tend to, generally speaking, I do tend to sleep quite well, and sleep almost straight away. Be asleep within the first 10 minutes of putting my head down, so I exhaust myself thinking, and in terms of relaxation, and I would say I’d like to go walking, but a step that’d be a complete lie because I haven’t really been out the house much these past few months, but it is something that I want to when the spring comes, is to do a bit more up, get out there and just get some fresh air, a bit of mindfulness, a bit of peace and quiet. Switch my phone off. Just enjoy the blue sky.
Frederique
Oh, yeah. So we are coming to an end to our chit chat. That was super good. I loved it. So would you be able to answer the following questions within your best abilities? Yes!
Adam
Yes.
Frederique
Don’t be scared!
Adam
Is there gonna be a drumroll or something like that?
Frederique
That would be great!
Adam
First question!
Frederique
That’s it! Pears or bananas?
Adam
Easy! Bananas, pears are vile.
Frederique
Okay! Lipsticks or mascara?
Adam
For these eyes, I’d say mascara.
Frederique
The Hulk or Batman?
Adam
Hulk.
Frederique
Okay. Oh, lovely.
Adam
I’m intrigued, I’m intrigued… why those questions?
Frederique
Um, it’s just to, for the audience to have fun…
Adam
Oh!
Frederique
…and to know you a little bit more and, yeah, just to close in a positive manner, let’s say. Because it’s always good, you know, despite the anxiety, the depression, we can still have fun and we are people and we do laugh also. Yeah, just to… for the audience to know you a little bit more, in a fun way.
Adam
Yes. Although, never ever send me any pears. I absolutely hate them.
Frederique
Really?
Adam
Oh, dreadful. That was such an easy answer, that one. But I love bananas, I have a banana every day.
Frederique
Okay, that’s good.
Adam
But pears… ugh.
(Closing music plays)
This podcast was edited by Airglow Audio. Find out more at airglowaudio.com. Professional creative audio.
(Closing music finishes)